During Sunday Evening Story-Time on July 25, 2010, with the ‘teaching elder’ of Illinois (AKA the Cunning Royal Jester), in his continual struggle to divide the second coming of Jesus Christ into 2 great installments .... he proposed that ‘the events are similar, but the distinctions don’t match.’ He acclaimed people who ‘understand the distinctive ministry of Paul’. He was attempting to separate THE appearing of Jesus Christ .... by saying that Paul wrote of a DIFFERENT coming .... than the 4 gospels record. To test the validity of the ‘teaching elder’s supposition, let’s begin among Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John.
1. Matthew and Mark say He will come ‘in’ the ‘clouds’ (plural) .... but the Greek words that were translated ‘in’ are different.
2. John wrote He will come ‘with’ ‘clouds’. So would the IL ‘teaching elder’ make a distinction here? Will His coming ‘in’ clouds be different than His coming ‘with’ clouds?
3. Luke records that He will come ‘in’ ‘a cloud’ (singular). Does the IL ‘teaching elder’ think His coming in plural clouds is different than His coming in a single cloud?
Matt 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn,
and they shall see the Son of man coming in [epi] the clouds [nephele] of heaven with power and great glory.
Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with [meta] clouds [nephele];
and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.
Mark 13:26 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in [en] the clouds [nephele] with great power and glory.
Luke 21:27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in [en] a cloud [nephele] with power and great glory.
Oh, the IL ‘teaching elder’ says THESE ‘distinctions that don’t match’ are all talking about the SAME event. But when PAUL shows Jesus will come from heaven, and the dead and alive are taken up in the clouds to meet the Lord .... then the IL ‘teaching elder’ teaches that 'that coming' (he calls the 'rapture') is an entirely different coming, more than 7 years BEFORE the coming recorded by Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. What extreme denial .... to protect his paradigm!
1 Thess 4:16-17 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in [en] the clouds [nephele], to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Now, let’s consider more verse abuse from the IL ‘teaching elder’.
Matthew and Mark both say His angels will be sent to gather together His elect from the four winds. However, Matthew says it will be from one end of HEAVEN to the other .... but Mark says it will be from the end of the EARTH to the farthest bounds of HEAVEN. So would the IL ‘teaching elder’ create 2 separate gatherings here .... one from heaven to heaven, and the other from earth to heaven? Oh no, he would say THIS ‘distinction that doesn’t match’ are is talking about the SAME event.
Matt 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Mark 13:27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.
But when PAUL wrote about the coming of the Lord and our gathering together unto Him .... the IL ‘teaching elder’ makes THIS a different coming and a different gathering of a different group of elect.
The IL ‘teaching elder’ also makes a point to say that in Matthew and Mark, it is the ANGELS that gather together the elect .... whereas, in Paul's writings, he says that the LORD Himself will give His personal attention and He does the gathering. But he is wrong, because NEITHER of the VERSES in Paul's writings say WHO will do the gathering:
2 Thess 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
1 Thess 4:16-17 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Next, we read about the sound of a trumpet at the Lord’s coming.
Matthew wrote about it and so did Paul. But the IL ‘teaching elder’ says Matthew’s trumpet is an angel’s trumpet, not God’s. Well, the angel is God’s angel, and the trumpet is God’s trumpet. Just like the IL ‘teaching elder’ teaches that Moses’ law (Heb 10:28), the law of Moses (Acts 28:28 and 21 other times) .... is actually God’s law, the law of God. But the IL ‘teaching elder’ is not even consistent with his own principles, when he then says, Paul’s trumpet is God’s trumpet, not an angel’s trumpet:
Matt 24:31 And he shall send his angels
with [meta] a great [megas] sound [phone] of a trumpet [salpigx],
and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
1 Cor 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at [en] the last [eschatos] trump [salpigx]: for [gar] the trumpet shall sound [salpizo], and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
In the previous verse, the Greek word [en] was translated ‘at’ .... and in the next verse, the same Greek word [en] was translated ‘with’. Do you think the IL ‘teaching elder’ would consider THIS ‘distinction that doesn’t match’ important enough to make 2 different trumps of it? Well, he doesn’t. But he does make 1 instrument sounding 2 times, so he can have a last trump (albeit, invented) and not have to take the last trump in the scripture, in Revelation, because the time of its sound does not fit his paradigm:
1 Thess 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with [en] the trump [salpigx] of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
Since the Cunning Royal Jester has changed from years of teaching 3 toots to currently teaching just 2 toots, his Jokers are following suit.
When the 7th angel sounds the 7th (last) trumpet, God’s kingdom will come:
Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
When the 7th angel sounds the 7th (last) trumpet, the mystery of God (also see Col 2:2, Eph 3:3-9, Col 4:3) will be over:
Rev 10:7 But in the days of the voice [phone] of the seventh angel, when he shall begin [mello] to sound [salpizo], the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.
There is also the issue about both the dead and the alive.
Jesus taught His disciples that not everyone will be dead when He comes:
Luke 9:26-27 For whosoever shall be ashamed of me and of my words, of him shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he shall come in his own glory, and in his Father's, and of the holy angels.
27 But I tell you of a truth, there be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the kingdom of God.
But when PAUL wrote that not all believers will be dead .... that some will still be alive, when the Lord comes .... the IL ‘teaching elder’ says THIS was previously UNKNOWN information:
1 Cor 15:51-52 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
My point is, that God REVEALED His secrets to the prophets (which includes Saul/Paul in Acts 13:1) .... and they harmonized His revelation to His righteous saints that fear Him:
Psa 25:14 The secret of the LORD is with them that fear him; and he will shew them his covenant.
Prov 3:32 For the froward is abomination to the LORD: but his secret is with the righteous.
Dan 2:47 The king answered unto Daniel, and said, Of a truth it is, that your God is a God of gods, and a Lord of kings, and a revealer of secrets, seeing thou couldest reveal this secret.
Amos 3:7 Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets.
Matthew wrote that Jesus said He will judge in His kingdom when He comes:
Matt 16:27-28 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.
28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.
Matt 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory,
and all the holy angels with him,
then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
Yet when PAUL wrote of the judgment of the Lord of both the alive and the dead .... at His coming and His kingdom (even in the one sentence) .... the IL ‘teaching elder’ takes a quantum leap by dividing ‘Paul from Paul’ when he teaches that Christ’s appearing will be a ‘pre-tribulation rapture’ (the 1st great installment?!) that will occur more than 7 years prior to the Lord’s 2nd coming (for Israel) when He will establish His kingdom on earth:
2 Tim 4:1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
John also described the Lord’s coming in judgment and vengence:
Rev 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
When PAUL recorded prophecy about the Lord’s coming in judgment to make war against His enemies and be glorified and admired in His elect .... both "in that day" .... AND 'with His angels' (like Matt 25:31) .... the IL ‘teaching elder’ splits apart this ‘distinction that doesn’t match’, too:
2 Thess 1:7-10 And to you who are troubled rest with us,
when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God,
and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints,
and to be admired in all them that believe
(because our testimony among you was believed)
in that day.
The IL ‘teaching elder’ said ‘The 2nd coming was a man-made term’.
Hmmmm .... maybe it could be ‘the 2nd appearing’ instead?
Heb 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many;
and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
Are you one of them who looks for the Lord’s appearing? Looking for it does not necessitate that it is imminent, any day now .... but that you have a stedfast hope, knowing He will come:
Phil 3:20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
Titus 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
Peter also wrote about looking for the day of the Lord to come (2 Pet 3:12-14).
Many times I have heard the IL ‘teaching elder’ preach, "Things that are different are not the same!" He uses that whenever HE wants to, then whenever he doesn’t want to use it, he flips it and goes the other way, to say that all the records don’t have the same information about the same event, but they give different facts.
Later in his message, as the IL ‘teaching elder’ attempted to link several passages, with different information, about the same event. There he did an ‘about-face’ and said the scripture ‘sort-of sprinkles stuff through .... a little information here and there’. What double-talk!
I have documented 83 times where at least 2 of the 4 gospel accounts record the same events, without the exact same details, but God’s records are in complete harmony. The IL ‘teaching elder’ teaches that the coming, appearing, trumpet, gathering, judgment, kingdom, last days, grace, mystery, revelation, etc. of which PAUL wrote .... were all separate things from the same things that anyone ‘outside of Paul’ wrote.
With all this evidence in scripture that proves the IL 'teaching elder' is wrong, no wonder he threw his arms and hands up in the air during this past Sunday evening's message, and bewailed, "So what if I'm wrong?"
1 Cor 14:8 For if the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle?
I would rather be prepared. How about you?
This is David Dowell, saying, "Think about it!"
